December 18, 2018

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Old 03-11-2013, 07:48 PM
Bamboo Bryan Bamboo Bryan is offline
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Wind Knot, that's not a bad idea. I don't know if this is common throughout NH but I do know that there are places (rock climbing at Rumney comes to mind) that ask that you pay $5 to park and climb there, however, it's on the honor system. I would like to see more things like that instituted to help spread the load out for the budget. Does anyone know how prevelant this honor system is throughout NH is?
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Old 03-11-2013, 09:02 PM
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MJ MJ is offline
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Default S&R for all paid by all.

It seems to me that since S&R is an emergency service that serves the general public and not just the hunting a fishing community, it should be funded by the general public. S&R has nothing to do with fish or game or the management of related resources, it is simply a matter of public safety. In my opinion the State should shoulder the financial burden for S&R, flat and simple. Utilize personal of the Fish & Game in conjunction withe other state, local and volunteer personnel of course, but it should be on the State's dime. Once again, S&R is a matter of public safety, not fish or wildlife. I'm all for the Fish & Game receiving funding from the State, but only if it is earmarked for S&R or other predetermined greater public safety emergencies and without any intrusion by the State in management of the Fish & Game. I would just like to see the State reimburse the Fish & Game for cost incurred in assisting the State in its business of public safety.

It seems rather straight forward to me.
Formerly Marcus1951

"I yam what I yam, and that's all that I yam!" (Popeye the sailor)
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Old 03-11-2013, 09:29 PM
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FurFace FurFace is offline
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A friend of mine who is an officer in F&G law enforcement wrote an article some time ago in a NH newspaper, (can't remember which paper it was in), but he discussed this issue, and related how he and his S&R team were criticised by one of these idgits for their "response time". The person got messed up in the mountains, called in on a cell phone and then sat and waited it out until the team could be assembled, organized, and finally located them. Can you believe that? I'm sorry, but people like that do need to pay their own tab.
If there was some type of (non-profit) program and educational efforts in place, I'd be happy to contribute and volunteer. But laying the burden of this solely at the feet of hunters and anglers is not right. It's the general public that needs and uses the services, and the general public should be covering the costs. Even more, folks from all over the region, (and even the country) travel to NH to recreate. Considering that, is it correct for NH tax payers to assume responsibility for the entire cost? How do you address that fairly?
Bryan, thanks, and hats off to you for your service. And in the case of a deceased individual, you're right, it would be cold to ask for payment for services, but that's where another source of funding is needed. There needs to be a kitty set up, and maintained by the general public. And somehow, it needs to be tied in with out-of-staters so the burden does not fall on the NH tax payer.
I wonder how they address this issue in other popular outdoor recreation states like Montana, Utah, Colorado...?
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:39 PM
Bamboo Bryan Bamboo Bryan is offline
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Every state is unique in terms of SAR. I know that when we have searches in VT that the primary agency in charge is the Vermont State Police, however, due to an unfortunate event with an avid teen hiker (had climbed Mt. Everest base camp if memory serves) died of exposure that was compounded by a severely broken leg. VSP got the missing persons call around 2am but did not mobilize a team and respond to the incident until 6:30am. Also if memory serves VSP lost the law suite and some emergency legislation was passed to spread the burden of SAR between the VSP and the VT F&G.

I think having either a particular states F&G department or its state police is pretty standard in terms of SAR responsibilities. A point that I've never honestly thought about is actually why its FG that does SAR when probably less than 5% of our missing persons are hunters/fishermen. I'll talk to my commander and see why he thinks some states have SAR fall to the FG department.

I don't know about finding a way to somehow have out-of-staters pay a fee incase they get lost. Sure it would be nice but I just don't see how there would be a practical way to do it. And besides, every state has SAR units that they have to pay for, so no matter which state you get lost in, someone is going to come looking for you. Granted there are states that probably foot a larger bill because of more outdoor activities, but in all honesty I think the amount of missing persons with mental illness outnumber the amount of hikers by such a large portion, I don't think charging maybe that one out of state person is really going to do all that much.

In terms of outdoor education and "lost-proofing" people, I whole heartedly agree. Its something I think everyone should do. Our sister organization, New England K-9 Search and Rescue, puts on a class for kids once a year which I think usually gets a pretty good turn out (probably because the kids want to see all the dogs!)

One last thing I've forgotten to mention is that I also know that many (NH included) utilizes the National Guard on a pretty regular basis (for us we use their helicopters with the infra red cameras) and depending on the severity of the situation they often time lend us man-power too.

And as far as the whiney hiker, your always going to have "that guy/gal" in any part of life. Sure they're being ignorant and stupid and those people are the ones that as a SAR operator you want to punch, but there's just nothing you can do about it. I don't do SAR to get "thank you"'s (to date, in 3 years, I've actually never once gotten a thank you from a patient/patient's family) I do it because I feel its the right thing to do and no matter how big of an a$$hole the person is, there is someone out there that loves them and wants them home.

Last edited by Bamboo Bryan; 03-11-2013 at 11:41 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:41 AM
truiteman truiteman is offline
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Just as a point of clarification. All monies collected for licenses have to be allocated to the Department or the Department can lose their Robinson-Pittman federal dollars.

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Old 03-12-2013, 11:51 AM
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wet_fly_action wet_fly_action is offline
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If everyone could stop pointing fingers for a minute, it's worth condsidering why F&G is asking for $550,000 (and then $745,000) when they are only allocating $200,000/yr for S&R.
How good to be here, in the green, dark, cool, mountains, near a ruddy camp fire, with the loneliness and beauty of nature at hand, and in my ears the music of a murmuring stream!
-Zane Grey
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:55 AM
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plecain plecain is offline
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Default Funding

There's (sort of) an explanation here about F&G funding:

Last edited by plecain; 03-12-2013 at 01:03 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:03 PM
goldendemon goldendemon is offline
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I would gladly check a box and donate to s&r but don't think any license money should be taken from the already underfunded fish and game for public safety issues
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Old 03-13-2013, 02:43 PM
Rainbow Rainbow is offline
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We could debate how to fix this problem till the cows come home. Bottom line is Fish & Game is in serious financial trouble. I think we all would agree that they contribute a great deal to the NH way of life. What we need to do now is make our voices heard. Contact your state senators and reps and let them know where you stand on this issue. There are also two regional hearings on the state budget in Rochester and Claremont on Monday, March 18, from 5:00 to 8:00 PM. They also could be losing some federal grant money depending upon the federal budget outcome. So do your part. If we want the NH way of life to continue, we must act now before it's too late.
Fish a lot!
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